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[eirias]

Tangential to an experience one of my friends is having with weight and weight loss, and inspired by some cool sculptures I saw at our campus art museum the other day, I want to mention something: I don't think attractiveness bears a simple monotonic relationship to weight. This is true even when you exclude the obviously-scary anorexics. I think that whether or not a body looks good has a lot less to do with size than it has to do with its having nice lines, for lack of a better way to put it. This is going to depend a lot on the particular frame your body has, and (when clothed) on how you dress it. Some people don't look great carrying any "extra" weight around, but some people do, and some of those people would look worse, IMO, if they got down to a "thin" size.

This is independent of health, of course -- people should think about that first, not about how hot they look at a given weight, and I think the health benefits of serious overweight are worth noting (though they are not, perhaps, the reason it has become an Issue in modern America; but I digress) -- but I think it bears mentioning.

EDIT: Err, make that health problems associated with serious overweight. Righty-o...

Comments

[leora.livejournal.com]

I just remember what I was taught in psych class about beauty... attractive weight varies hugely culturally. For females though, attractive ratios do not vary much at all. How much weight is pretty is a fad, but what makes someone likely to really be pretty or not is how big their breasts are compared to their waist, and how that compares to the hips. That and symmetry. Or mostly symmetry with one unusual breakage of symmetry that isn't viewed as disgusting. That and looking fairly average or better yet, 10% feminized from the average face.

Of course, there isn't much you can do to create these effects. But what is really attractive is health and youth. So, you can try to cultivate health. You can try to look young, but that actually really annoys me. I prefer to embrace maturity and wisdom and try to make people value age. Sure, youth is good for energy, language acquisition, and child-bearing, but age is good for a whole lot of things.

[eirias.livejournal.com]

For females though, attractive ratios do not vary much at all. How much weight is pretty is a fad, but what makes someone likely to really be pretty or not is how big their breasts are compared to their waist, and how that compares to the hips.

I've heard this too, and it's in line with my own thoughts. Proportional curves are sexy -- and in my mind can be a lot sexier than proportional lack-of-curves. When I gain weight, I gain it all on the bottom and I just look silly; but when some people gain weight, their figure just gets a little more "wow." :)

[ukelele.livejournal.com]

Maybe we should arrange a trade. When I gain weight, some of it goes straight to the boobs, and then I never lose it ever. But I have no ass! A trade here could be to mutual advantage...

[eirias.livejournal.com]

*LOL*!
I am highly amused, and Graham highly disturbed. Perhaps he likes my ghetto booty. ;)
Also, I have realized recently that if my boobs ever get large (e.g. during pregnancy) I'm going to have self-image trouble. Even if I put on a padded bra I start to look like someone else in the mirror.

[ksledgemoore.livejournal.com]

yeah, attractiveness probably does not bear a simple monotonic relationship to weight, but it probably DOES bear a monotonic relationship to health! For certain frames, being thin is the most healthy. For others, being fat is. I have tiny bones and would look and be unhealthy if I were even an average weight for my height (I am less), whereas one of my best friends has very big bones and she would look scary if she were an average weight for her height (she is more).

As leora said, there are culturally-independent ideals for women for waist-hip ratios (and probably breast-waist ratios...unfortunately for me...haha). I'm not sure what there is for men -- maybe something regarding their shoulder width.

It's sad that people get too caught up with weight loss, women in particular. I was at the gym this morning and there was a girl there who was extremely thin who was weighing herself. Whatever, a lot of people weigh themselves...but then she went to the bathroom, returned, and got back on the scale again. That made me a little sad.

[ukelele.livejournal.com]

Nonetheless, when I lose this weight post-pregnancy, I shall be doing it to be healthy and to be a babe and wear awesome pants ;).

[eirias.livejournal.com]

Rock on! :)

Yeah, I have no problem with people trying to lose weight. This came up, actually, because of one of those horrible situations where someone's losing weight because of health problems and her friends can't stop complimenting her on the weight loss. I mean, criminy, folks, "starving" ain't sexy.

[superwombatgirl.livejournal.com]

Did you happen to go see the Alexander Archipenko exhibit at the Chazen? I've been meaning to get to that for a while now!

[eirias.livejournal.com]

Yes! That was the one I meant!
I LOVED some of his sculptures. :)

[superwombatgirl.livejournal.com]

ooh goody! I'll have to stop making excuses and get my buns over there this week then!

[vfoxy.livejournal.com]

Much of attractiveness is also due to good posture and bearing as well, which is often a result of good self-esteem and health...

[eirias.livejournal.com]

Oh yeah, how one moves can totally change things, too!

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[sagittalbreast.livejournal.com]

All day yesterday I thought about responding to this post. But if I did, I would have to switch academic fields, go into psychology and write a freakin' book on the whole collapsed spider web of thoughts I have on human attractiveness (normalized values & the media, racism, art, shame [the bible], fantasies about traveling back in time, and my own extreme fondness for female homo sapiens).

But, instead, I won't say anything, except that I just did. In baseball, that's called a balk, so please leave the bat and take your base (adjust crotch and spit).

[jmmartin19.livejournal.com]

I'm a little late to the game here, but I totally agree with you Erin, and so does J. Oliver, author of "Fat Politics". If you're looking for anything to read, I'd recommend it. He talks about the history of beauty and also where the BMI came from and then basically asserts that the steps our country has taken to make "healthy/thin" people is cause a "dying to be thin" reaction--in a literal sense. It's pretty interesting! I can't say it's a watertigiht book, but I really liked it and it gave me all the ammo I need to tell people to shove their BMI indexes where the sun don't shine.